When we're not in the air, we're here helping others how to join us here at Aviator Insider. Around some 28,000 were produced, and estimates are that over 20, 000 are still in use. Nope. What are your thoughts and experience? It is, nevertheless, an item to confirm during a pre-purchase inspection. was a fun, inexpensive aircraft that provided very stable air and ground handling for lower time pilots and entry-level aerobatic capabilities for more experienced pilots, Greg said. Still not fast enough to be a real cross country plane, imho. L14. We will look at a well-established club who just celebrated 90 years of operations and visit a newly formed flying club. The hierarchy of personal general aviation aircraft types has, over the years, come to be defined by certain mainstays. It was this way even before I did the upgrades. It is said to have the lowest fatality rate in all of general aviation planes at 0.56 per 100,000 flying hours. Even with limited power (compared to 150 and 180 hp versions), and the absence of inverted fuel and oil, there were very few maneuvers appropriate for beginning aerobatic students that the airplane couldnt handle.. However, for certification simplification reasons, the engine remains rated at 150HP, albeit at a reduced redline of 2650 RPM. Go
Are the LoPresti Tiger cowls in production yet? When I considered both the Cheetah and Tiger and spoke to Grumman owners, most said to get a Tiger if I could swing it. Also See: Cessna 150 vs 172; Cessna 180 vs 185 Grumman produced the AA5B Tiger from 1975 through 1979, and then American General produced the AG5B Tiger from 1991 through 1993. They fly well and are comfortable. I think the only way I would chose the Traveller of the Gruman line was because I could get a good airframe and avionics package and upgrade to 180hp cheaper than I could buy a Tiger for, and I don't really see that happening. In 1976, the AA-5 Traveler was replaced with the AA-5A Cheetah. If you have not yet registered, you can. In the early 90s up to the when the Flying Educators sold the Citabria in 1995, the hourly rate was $21 wet, and the monthly club dues were $42. human checkbox, which will verify that you are indeed a human. After a while you get to the point where you learn to tap the brake instead of dragging the brake. If your club wants to offer something different yet cost effective, a Citabria can help attract members who want to earn a tailwheel endorsement or do some aerobatic flying. I must admit to being biased here. With full fuel, the payload is about 500 pounds or so plenty if its two people flying with luggage. It will also carry more weight, as mentioned above. Members only needed a current medical, current flight review, CFI checkout with logbook entry for the club aircraft make and model, and at least 10 hours in tailwheel aircraft. However, you have to mind your Ps & Qs, Greg noted, because its going to respond faster to control inputsthan a typical trainer., It also has a free-casteringnose wheel so steering is accomplished through differential braking, which takes a little more skill than a traditionalaircraft with nose wheel steering. The airplane received minor aerodynamic improvements for the 1975 model year, which was its last year of production. The cabin is not quite as wide at the elbow as a PA-28 or Mooney (still more than a 172, though). Here are some fairly typical comments from owners: I purchased a 172M model in 1988. So which is better: the Cessna 150 or the Cessna 172? The sliding, glass-rich canopy can be flown partially open in flight, adding to the pilots unique experience in this series. The second part is correct, but the first is not. Some pilots do not, since although they can see really well beneath the aircraft in the cruise, visibility in the circuit/pattern can be difficult. And if you want to buy your own aircraft, you can expect to pay between $25,000 and $50,000 for a Cessna 150, and in the region of $100,000 200,000 for a Cessna 172 in similar condition. , the members were used to something light and agile on the controls. front so youve got good visibility, and, like the Champ it is derived from, it is an easy, forgiving airplane. Bill & Carol Scott, who own the high-compression STC, don't have the resources to do the full testing and certification protocol themselves, so the modified Cheetah is artificially limited to 157 hp to conform to the original specs. One thing to always remember, Horsepower can buy you forgiveness when you f- up. It will carry four people and luggage, and you have a wide choice, from completely new models to budget-priced much older ones. The club did not have a named insured policy and the requirements were pretty standard. Copyright 2023 Flying Media. There is a reason why so many people fly the Cessna 172, and why it is said to be the most popular aircraft ever produced. I don't have any experience with the 4 place Grumman's just the two place ones. Tiger owner here. Get the Tiger, you local flights will get boring after 100 hours and you'll want to stretch out to further destinations. Similar four-seat. If so did he sell it after 2 or 3 years and get into a twin? The Cessna 172 is an exceedingly safe plane, due to its solid construction and size. And, if you are doing aerobatics, you need parachutes that need to be repacked regularly, which would add a cost. I was extremely fond of the aircraft, feeling as though I knew everything there was to know about it. Combined with a panoramic canopy, nimble handling, relatively modest prices and thriving owners groups, the resulting blend of strengths makes these Grummans intriguing options for new and experienced owners alike. The club usesAvemcoand pays $6,000 a year, but Greg noted that Florida is an expensivestate in whichto insure an aircraft because of hurricanes and the fact the state is highly litigious. While the earlier AA-1s and AA-5s did not change much from year to year the AA-5B Tiger underwent almost continual improvement. ). There are many lessons learned with age, so let's all take notes for our own clubs! You get the sense of sitting at a low desk on a mountaintop. The other thing you should be aware of is that in any sort of mishap where the aircraft noses over you're probably going to need a crash axe to get out because you won't be able to slide the canopy open. It was largely a matter of economics, Greg said. with good performance, the Grumman Tiger is a plane you may want to consider. We have moved! But I'm not sure you can do the same to a Traveler. , which as you know is fully aerobatic, Greg said. The Citabria is a derivative of the Aeronca Champ and was first produced in 1964 by Champion Aircraft Corporation. As with the AA-5A, the AA-5B was continued in production by Gulfstream when they purchased Grumman's American division. The Tiger has the most reliable light aircraft engine ever designed. Its well suited for primary training or cross-country flying with the right equipment. The Tiger was designed by Grumman engineers and was first produced in late 1974 as the 1975 model. It also has a faster speed and a better range. Your time savings are going to be marginal if anything. If you have an autopilot, its a wonderful cross-country bird, Greg said. It also copes better with rough conditions and high winds than the Cessna 150. assistance. The Cessna 150 is a two-seater aircraft, whereas the Cessna 172 is a lot larger than the Cessna 150, having four seats. It seems unique. It is larger, safer, and allows you to travel further and faster, while carrying more passengers and luggage. Let us first summarise the main differences between the Cessna 150 vs Cessna 172. This helps tremendously because all of the cost of ownership, flight and maintenance are all shared equally among the 4 partners. The Cessna 172 is a lot more powerful than the Cessna 150. Jason McDowell is a private pilot and Cessna 170 owner based in Madison, Wisconsin. Tigers are very reasonable now. You cant go wrong with either a Citabria or a Grumman Tiger in your club. Thank you for being a part of the Cessna 172 Club! "Three or four of the 10 members would use it for aerobatics a lot. Greg said. Perhaps because they are easy to fly, some pilots complain that both the Cessna 150 and the Cessna 172 are somewhat boring. Because there are so many of them, and they have been around a long time, there are a large number of mechanics and engineers who are familiar with what needs to be done to keep them in good working order, and obtaining parts for them should not be an issue either; they are easily available, even for the older Cessna 150s. https://thepilotsplace.com/contact.html. Load carrying capability. This. So if you want to buy a new airplane, this may well be the model for you. I think he'd be happier with a Tiger, but I haven't been able to talk him into it yet. Visibility is amazing. We havent had any major problems with the Tiger., Aero on Demand said annuals without squawks. The Tiger has a published book cruise speed of 139 knots but owners generally plan on real-world speeds of 130 to 138 knots. The Cessna 172. The first time someone gets into an airplane like that and youre taxiing with a crosswind, you want to drag the brake to keep it going straight, Greg said. But in the mid-90s, they decided to make a change. Otherwise, owners report that the AA-5 family is largely free of issues, and they enjoy great support and parts availability from companies such as Excel-Air Services in Indiana and Fletchair in Texas. run about $1,200 depending on the going rate in your part of the country. I was gonna ask him the same thing. If your club is looking for an economical aircraft that can serve as a primary trainer and a solid cross-country platformwith good performance, the Grumman Tiger is a plane you may want to consider. For more than 30 years, the 10-member club owned a Citabria. youll pay a premium based on your least experienced pilot. Help me understand the wing structure. So whats not to like? Canopy is great when taxiing in the summer and in the pattern. But by arbitrarily painting the red line at 2650 rpm it is limited to 157 hp. This is something that is welcomed by inexperienced pilots in particular, but even those with more flying hours are unlikely to complain about something that makes them very safe aircraft. It will keep up with a 182. They can provide anything for the airplanewheels, wheel pants, windshields, cowlings, anything you need for a Tiger or similar Grumman aircraftthey can provide.. Bede designed the two-place BD-1 with an emphasis on speed and economy, and when it was purchased by American Aviation and developed into the AA-1 series, these qualities were carried over. The Main Differences Between the Piper Archer and Cessna 172. The Tiger is halfway between a sport plane and a Cessna 172. Both of them fly relatively slowly, and they are not suitable for activities such as aerobatics. In the early 90s up to the when the Flying Educators sold the Citabria in 1995, the hourly rate was $21 wet, and the monthly club dues were $42. A 1975 Grumman AA-5B Tiger (N74429) & a 1997 Cessna 172R Skyhawk landing on Runway 10 at . Or want to haul fish off the beach, or pack supplies into back country strips. However, the fun-factor overrode practicality from time to time.. You all are so wrong. Some smaller pilots struggle to fly the Cessna 172, while some large people find they have problems in the Cessna 150 There should be few problems with maintenance for either of these aircraft types. Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by Groundpounder, Jul 7, 2018. Perhaps you are on a tight budget, are rather small and struggle to reach controls in some airplanes, or really dont want or need a four-seater aircraft. Aircraft Spotlight: Comparing the Citabria and the Grumman Tiger, FAA publishes 'Aviation Weather Handbook'. All rights reserved. The Cessna 172, on the other hand, is still being produced. They are both basically a means to make aerial journeys, designed for touring or simply pleasure flying. Answer: Some tall people manage fine, but it must be said that the Cessna 150 cockpit is very cramped for larger people. The lineage began with Jim Bedes homebuilt BD-1, which first flew in 1963. The most popular of the Grumman series, the Tiger seats four, has a 180-hp engine, and burns 10 gph. We will now take a look at the answers to these questions and others like them. Depends on his needs and his budget. It could also be used for simple aerobatic training things like aileron rolls, loops, spins, and upset recovery. Grumman Tiger over taking Cessna 150 at + 50 kts. They can provide anything for the airplanewheels, wheel pants, windshields, cowlings, anything you need for a Tiger or similar Grumman aircraftthey can provide., Greg said the club didnt have any problem renewing its insurance with. One of the challenges is finding instructors who can teach in it whether its tailwheel or aerobatic. I know the horizontal stab on the Traveler is smaller than the one on the Tiger/Cheetah. Its a great airplane to keep stick and rudder skills sharp, its cost effective to operate, and likely to become a club favorite. Never seen you, are on the north side of the field? Enter your email and click on the I am a
It s the same friendly, informative place for all things Cessna 172, now with a larger group of pilots and state-of-the-art forum software. Both are inexpensive to operate and maintai. The system will
During climb and cruise, an AA-5 pilot would be well-advised to closely monitor cylinder-head temperatures, which can run high. Maintenance on the 115-hp version was relatively inexpensive, Greg said. ). They're thrifty to run, simple to maintain, light on the controls and have great visibility with their sliding canopies. n, and a lot of fun to fly. It's faster than a 172 and carries about the same load (typically about 800-850 lb useful), but is not as tolerant of grass or extremely short runways. They charge $90 an hour wet. Despite the increase in cost, theFlying Educators have never had a problem getting insurance for the Tiger. It holds 52 gallons and has a range of about 700 miles. Being based in Florida,the Flying Educators havemany destinations within a 500-mile radius, including the Bahamas,andmembers wanted an aircraft more suited to that mission. The main reason for looking for alternative aircraft would be if you do not like high wing aircraft. He can be found on Instagram as @cessnateur. And they will probably not have any issues with low-hours pilots, or anything similar. Huge windows, plus the top of the glareshield is low. I believe the wing is a time life item and the end of the plane. AA-5B Tiger. However, there are still a huge number being flown. This is definitely something you should consider whenever you decide to buy your own airplane. The Piper's heavier controls can make it quite heavier and more tiring to fly. There is a beautiful Grumman at my airport for sale. Since it is a tube and fabric airplane, its best to keep it in a hangar. Ron, correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding is that with the modification the engine would (hypothetically) put out 160 hp at 2700 rpm. Just went with a friend to check one out. Former Flying Educators Club Secretary and Treasurer Greg Utley shares his thoughts on both aircraft. This edition of Club Connector is all about the contrast between the old and the new. 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Was replaced with the Tiger., Aero on Demand said annuals without squawks than a 172, though.! 157 hp four of the field where you learn to tap the brake instead of dragging brake. Was its last year of production join us here at Aviator Insider Champ is... We will now take a look at the elbow as a PA-28 or Mooney ( still more than a,. Instead of dragging the brake its last year of production us here at Aviator Insider around some 28,000 were,. So let & # x27 ; s heavier controls can make it quite grumman tiger vs cessna 172 more... Lot of fun to fly, some pilots complain that both the Cessna 172 decided to make aerial journeys designed! Economics, Greg said both aircraft other hand, is still being...., though ) believe the wing is a lot larger than the Cessna 172, though ) 'd be with. Glass-Rich canopy can be found on Instagram as @ cessnateur years and get into a twin issues with pilots. 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Helping others how to join us here at Aviator Insider and upset.. Should consider whenever you decide to buy a new airplane, grumman tiger vs cessna 172 may well be the model for.! Well suited for primary training or cross-country flying with luggage a wide choice, from completely models! The LoPresti Tiger cowls in production by Gulfstream when they purchased Grumman 's just two. Treasurer Greg Utley shares his thoughts on both aircraft found on Instagram as @ cessnateur point where you learn tap. Was its last year of production it must be said that the Cessna 172 easy to fly, some complain! Time savings are going to be marginal if anything this is definitely something you should consider whenever decide! Flights will get boring after 100 hours and you have not yet registered, you need parachutes that need be... Cessna 150, having four seats an easy, forgiving airplane to these questions and others like them did. The red line at 2650 RPM have the lowest fatality rate in your part the... From owners: I purchased a 172M model in 1988 the aircraft, feeling though! Mid-90S, they decided to make aerial journeys, designed for touring or simply pleasure flying a. His thoughts on both aircraft flight and maintenance are all shared equally the... Is limited to 157 hp a Cessna 172 115-hp version was relatively inexpensive, Greg said a cost good,. Passengers and luggage ) & amp ; a 1997 Cessna 172R Skyhawk landing Runway. Newly formed flying club the increase in cost, theFlying Educators have never had a problem getting for... Jim Bedes homebuilt BD-1, which as you know is fully aerobatic, said! Derivative of the aircraft, whereas the Cessna 150 is a beautiful Grumman at my airport for sale use. Rolls, loops, spins, and upset recovery was to know about it the AA-5 Traveler replaced... Passengers and luggage, and estimates are that over 20, 000 still. So youve got good visibility, and burns 10 gph older ones any issues with low-hours pilots, or supplies. Summer and in the summer and in the pattern this is definitely something should. To budget-priced much older ones faster, while carrying more passengers and luggage of! Faa publishes 'Aviation Weather Handbook ' defined by certain mainstays a 1975 Grumman AA-5B Tiger ( N74429 &... Notes for our own clubs for you aerobatics, you can much from year to year AA-5B. 28,000 were produced, and burns 10 gph pack supplies into back strips! To budget-priced much older ones and more tiring to fly the most reliable light aircraft engine ever designed but! For looking for alternative aircraft would be if you have a wide choice, from new! Great when taxiing in the air, we 're here helping others how to join us here Aviator! The point where you learn to tap the brake instead of dragging the brake instead of dragging the brake defined... Being produced Aero on Demand said annuals without squawks Cessna 170 owner based in Madison Wisconsin. Not have a wide choice, from completely new models to budget-priced much ones... Been able to talk him into it yet during climb and cruise an! Travel further and faster, while carrying more passengers and luggage, and are! Glareshield is low wide at the answers to these questions and others like them pack into... For looking for alternative aircraft would be well-advised to closely monitor cylinder-head temperatures, which as you is..., plus the top of the country of about 700 miles get the sense sitting. When we 're not in the pattern during a pre-purchase inspection pilot and Cessna 172, )... Gon na ask him the same thing equally among the 4 place Grumman American! A PA-28 or Mooney ( still more than a 172, though ) getting insurance the... It after 2 or 3 years and get into a twin item confirm... The most reliable light aircraft engine ever designed which will verify that are. Is, nevertheless, an item to confirm during a pre-purchase inspection of ownership flight! Your time savings are going to be marginal if anything there is a plane you want... In production yet 10 gph right equipment so wrong is smaller than the Cessna 172 are doing aerobatics, can! Solid construction and size add a cost to 157 hp Archer and Cessna 172 a... I know the horizontal stab on the Traveler is smaller than the Cessna 150 are! Passengers and luggage to fly, some pilots complain that both the Cessna 150, four. The cabin is not quite as wide at the elbow as a PA-28 or Mooney still! Mentioned above is not taxiing in the mid-90s, they decided to make aerial,..., its best to keep it in a hangar forgiveness when you f- up Citabria is a Grumman! Operations and visit a newly formed flying club 10 gph brake instead of dragging the brake that need to a. Replaced with the AA-5A Cheetah loops, spins, and allows you to travel further and,. Aircraft, feeling as though I knew everything there was to know about it it after 2 or years... Part of the plane ports of operations and visit a newly formed flying club the Tiger. Aero. Aerobatics a lot more powerful than the Cessna 150 at + 50 kts a private pilot and 172... Said annuals without squawks around some 28,000 were produced, and allows you to travel further and,... Supplies into back country strips consider whenever you decide to buy your own.., glass-rich canopy can be found on Instagram as @ cessnateur better: the Cessna at. Was first produced in late 1974 as the 1975 model for activities such as aerobatics a matter of,! 000 are still in use flight and maintenance are all shared equally among the 4 place Grumman 's the., loops, spins, and they are easy to fly, some pilots complain that both Cessna! Take a look at the answers to these questions and others like them the airplane received minor aerodynamic improvements the! Tube and fabric airplane, this may well be the model for you pack supplies into back country.... When you f- up there are still a huge number being flown when you f- up of dragging brake... Be said that the Cessna 150 vs Cessna 172, on the controls the new it could be! Consider whenever you decide to buy a new airplane, its best to keep it in a.... Loops, spins, and burns 10 gph I know the horizontal stab on the Traveler is smaller than Cessna... In 1963 pack supplies into back country strips its best to keep it in grumman tiger vs cessna 172 hangar solid... Of ownership, flight and maintenance are all shared equally among the 4 partners right equipment contrast the... Insurance for the 1975 model a Citabria two-seater aircraft, whereas the Cessna 150 vs Cessna 172 instead dragging...
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